Baldy Loop 2008 Version

sam_hikes · Joined: 07 Apr 2003 Posts: 383

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azbackpackr · Posted: 8/22/2008, 4:17 am Post subject:

Not sure why you put my pal Vicente's name in caps. He's a good guy. A bureaucrat, sure, but a good person. And if he's the one the public is supposed to contact regarding the progress of the road, all that means is that he is the one who was appointed by his superiors in the FS to take crap off the public.

But everyone up here is wondering why it's taking so long, whether it was, as you said, the contractor's mistake in not understanding the nature of the climate at 9300 feet, or if the contracting company has been dragging it out on purpose to make more money, or both. I have ridden my bike and hiked to the West Baldy trailhead numerous times in the past couple of years, and it always looks about the same--heavy equipment and stuff sitting around. No pavement had been laid down there yet as of August 10, when I rode my bike on the RR Grade Trail to there.

I've said this before, I'll say it again. Get a copy of Arizona's Mountains by Bob Martin, and a stack of topo maps. There are so many places to hike in the White Mountains where you will see no one. Canyons and creeks, cinder cones and little peaks with a view. You don't need Mt. Baldy. Been there, done that.

Seems like most people don't even go to the "white man's summit" cairn of Baldy anyway, if I've been reading the trail reports correctly both on this site and HAZ, so what's the point? The summit is where the 350 degree views are, the summit is where you can see the San Francisco Peaks, Mt. Taylor, the Catalinas and the Superstitions, the Chiricahuas and the Gilas, on a clear day. If you don't go to that particular summit cairn, you didn't "collect" the summit as to peakbagger's rules, you wouldn't have signed the register, so you can't put that peak on your list, if you are honest about your peakbagging. There is always at least one register there, and sometimes someone places a second one there.

And if you're not into keeping lists and peakbagging, and "getting" that particular peak on your list, then there are plenty of other places to hike.

azbackpackr · Posted: 8/22/2008, 4:42 am Post subject:

sam_hikes · Joined: 07 Apr 2003 Posts: 383

Sorry about that azbackpackr... Vo is the guy you want to talk with about the AZ273 project as he's the goto guy. Vo will tell you AZ273 is closed to everyone/bikes from FR87 to AZ261 but they have an alt East TH via Burro Mtn.

In the last several years there has been discussion on the true highpoint of Mt Baldy as some topos and many gps units indicate a 11,420ft point on FS vs the official Apache spot. (Upper portions of East trail cross into Apache lands a little b/4 connecting with West trail)

Several years ago the Apaches put up a huge billboard type sign near the 11,420ft trying to inform folks they were trespassing but somehow FS got it removed as I think it was on FS land. Rolling Eyes

sam_hikes · Joined: 07 Apr 2003 Posts: 383

here's more info on the project but it lacks the new estimated completion date which has slipped to 2009+ ( notice Vo's name )

also listed are TH directions via Burro Mtn.

http://www.wmicentral.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=19778340&BRD=2264&PAG=461&dept_id=581751&rfi=6

sam_hikes · Joined: 07 Apr 2003 Posts: 383

more 273 news + why it won't be paved till there's funding

http://www.zwire.com/site/index.cfm?newsid=19823853&BRD=2264&PAG=461&dept_id=505965&rfi=8

azbackpackr · Posted: 8/22/2008, 6:30 pm Post subject:

Most people up here are unhappy about the paving, as far as I've been able to determine.

Hadn't heard there was a significant summit actually on FS land--I had thought there were two summits and both on the Rez, but that the Apaches had decided to tolerate us haoles on the summit closest to the trails.

I did see that great big sign, though. I think that was in 2002. And the following year it was completely gone. So we tramped on up to the peak. That one year was the only year we didn't go to the cairn.

While you were perusing the White Mtn. Independent's website, Sam, did you happen to notice on the side bar they have a little magazine they publish, called White Mtn. Outdoors? There's an article in there called "The Black River Wade." I don't know how to make it have a link onto here, though, as there is no top bar on there when you open it.

Let me know if you like the article! Mr. Green

sam_hikes · Joined: 07 Apr 2003 Posts: 383

nice article... I've taken East Trail approach over to the Black River and up to Baldy Peak which was nice.

Baldy is headwaters for LC & Black which is pretty amazing since LC drains into GC. Amazing to also see LC running year-round under tons of snow--some scary deep snow holes in late winter/early spring that I wonder if anyone ever falls into. ( we've seen holes close to 20ft deep while snowshoe'n up to the peak )

azbackpackr · Posted: 8/22/2008, 7:36 pm Post subject:

Watersheds are interesting, indeed, but everything theoretically ends up in the Colorado River, either via the LCR or the Black-Salt-Gila-Colorado, or the Blue-SF-Gila-Colorado. Theoretically, because, as every Arizonan knows, the Salt and the Gila have some very long dry stretches, except during floods. Well, so does the Little Colorado, for that matter. Drive just a few miles to the east of here, to Pie Town NM, though, and you'll cross the Continental Divide!

I do the Black River Wade every year with various friends, and almost always as a backpack so we can camp right by the river. We got pretty wet this year--six river crossings to yet another swimming hole, plus lots of rain!

sam_hikes · Joined: 07 Apr 2003 Posts: 383

latest word from FS is blowdown/tree clearing project got cancelled due to no funds at last minute. Update on 273 project is project still delayed due to weather and Spring partial opening being planned.

all the downed trees (probably over 100) make West trail no fun.

My suggestion would be to use East trail via alt TH at Burro Mtn

I like East trail best except in deep snow as East seems to get huge drifts compared to West

sam_hikes · Joined: 07 Apr 2003 Posts: 383

anyone recall how many large trees are down on the East trail of Mt Baldy?

sam_hikes · Joined: 07 Apr 2003 Posts: 383

Weather radar indicated many of last night's storms initially formed in/around Mt Baldy. NWS says many storms are triggered from this area.

I was lucky as storms missed Mt Ord last night so I was able to hike to over 6,000ft b/4 it got crazy. What a show driving down Hwy87 from 4Peaks Jct south as the entire horizon was on fire in all directions. Too bad I missed the view from home but hiking is my 2nd home.

sam_hikes · Joined: 07 Apr 2003 Posts: 383

Joe and others--273 highway project is basically done but ADOT won't be re-opening road till after winter snow has melted. Gates are coming down and/or are already open or will be in the next week+.

USFS has finally posted West Baldy Trail with a large free standing folding sign stating upwards of 200 downed trees which as of yesterday has been reduced by my count to 50+ covering only the last mile of switchbacks to the 11,000ft+ summit ridge. 3-6" of snow in a few parts of only Baldy peak as well as the usual lower switchbacks of the West Trail. (upper switchbacks were dry)

At the ridge/trail jct if you go right instead of left you can follow the old topo pack trail over to Mt Warren which also leads to what I think is AZ's highest signed trailhead parking lot at 11,000ft. I scoped out the area and couldn't find any survey markers for the peak but the Apache's have a very nice road and have logged the 11,000ft peak. (appears many/many years ago for the highpoint)

Anyone ever ventured over to Mt Warren? It's an easy/short walk from the West/East trail jct.

How about Mt Thomas? I've not bagged the actual highpoint but have hiked close to the highpoint on the Black River side via the old East Baldy trail as well as part of another off-trail venture to Baldy highpoint up the Black River drainage.

azbackpackr · Posted: 11/23/2008, 6:05 am Post subject:

At the ridge/trail junction you mentioned, since I always hike up the East Baldy trail, I walk straight on through the clearing. (This would be the same trail as turning right in clearing off of West Baldy Trail.) This trail bears off to the left (south) and climbs up to a high point, which everyone calls the White Man's Summit. It has a very large cairn, 5 or 6 ft. tall, and usually one or two hiker's registers have been placed there by various clubs.

Ok, from this point, where is Mt. Warren? Oh, just looked at my CD topo--I see that the peak I go to is actually labeled Baldy Peak, to the south of trail junction, whereas Mt. Warren is to the northwest.

Thanks for the info about the FS clearing up the trail, Sam. Glad they got busy up there. Guess with the dry weather I'm not too surprised there isn't more snow up there right now. By the way, I sent you a private message, be sure to check! Thanks.

Elizabeth

sam_hikes · Joined: 07 Apr 2003 Posts: 383

My NG Topo pgm clearly shows 2 spur trails not far from East/West Jct leading to Mt Warren. Suspect the TH I saw is how the Apache's access Baldy Peak as it's only an easy mile or so of easy walking across the USFS highpoint ridge to their highpoint which I think is lower.