Seriously depressing

Daddee · Posted: 6/26/2006, 10:50 pm Post subject: Seriously depressing

Once again, this summer and the ongoing drought has made this particular forum some of the most depressing reading on the Internet.

Fire season is a real downer.

I wonder what different kinds of hells the policy makers are going through trying to figure out how to deal with current conditions caused by prior policy failures. I am glad I don't have thier jobs right now.

[sigh]
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IGO · Joined: 08 Feb 2005 Posts: 4144 Location: Las Vegas

We've all read it a dozen times but here's a reminder.
Starting around the turn of the last century this country started to hammer down ANY forest fires. That was the policy for 70 or 80 years. Often times I think "How beautiful" a natural understory is but indeed these understorys are not natural.
If one of your (anybody and everybody) favorite forest burns, do not dispair. Walk in anyway. Veiws open up and watching what happens as it comes back around is a wonderful thing. Don't dispare foks.
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Shawn · Posted: 6/27/2006, 5:51 am Post subject:

Amen Robert, its all natural.

The fire seasons of the early 1900's were horrific, and tragic, the resulting policies while ultimately wrong, are understandable. We're all learning.
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Hikngrl · Posted: 6/27/2006, 6:20 am Post subject:

Very good point Robert! Just hard to hold onto when you are watching it happen and it is taking away all your hiking possibilities...
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azbackpackr · Posted: 6/27/2006, 7:14 am Post subject:

Shows to go you how dangerous emotionalism can be. Study up on botany, ecology, fire adaptation, etc.

Sure it looks ugly to us after it's burned, we are programmed to see beauty only in certain ways.

I've been mtn. biking a couple times in the Rodeo-Chediski burn. I have never seen so many wildflowers! Also lots of young Gambels Oak and other trees. Lots more fresh green forage for the deer, elk and other critters. They love it! Why don't we?

PageRob · Joined: 03 Mar 2005 Posts: 859 Location: Page, Az.

Oh my goodness, yeah. The spring after a wildfire there will be more flowers than you can believe! Gamble oak, and eventually (depending on elevation) aspens. All those beautiful aspen groves that are so wonderful to hike through are basically the last stage in a burned area before the pines push them out.
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Daddee · Posted: 6/27/2006, 11:12 am Post subject:

Like I said, prior policy decisions have created the current situation.

Mother nature knows best, we just don't have the knowledge to do any better, and usually end up doing much, much worse.

[sigh]
_________________
"Only small minds want always to be right."
- Louis XIV

"...haven't you lived long enough to know that two men may honestly differ about a question and both be right?"
- Abraham Lincoln

BoyNhisDog · Posted: 6/27/2006, 2:39 pm Post subject:

The bark beetles are helping a lot with this year’s decisions. There are many dead trees all over just waiting. These have only appeared in the last few years. Some of these storms can have a few thousand lightning strikes and that fuel will accommodate. We have a lot of burning to go. Natural or not, I always find the big fires depressing as well.

That said, we did see some stunning wildflowers in a smaller burn area in the White Mountains recently.
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Hnak · Joined: 06 Jan 2003 Posts: 1766 Location: Prescott, AZ

For what it's worth, it's raining like crazy here.... I love the smell of rain, the cool breeze, the rumble of thunder off in the distance, the flash of lightning, and the concern of how I'm going to get home on my motorcycle without drowning.... Silly

I knew that if I kept riding my cycle to work I would eventually bring rain. Works every time... Agree

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Daddee · Posted: 6/27/2006, 3:06 pm Post subject:

From what I understand we're kind of in the middle of a really vicious cycle. The bark beetle normally wouldn't be able to kill a tree that easily, but the drought has weakened the trees to the point where they can't defend against them. Then, the drought has dried up all the ground cover to the point where you might as well have just spread lighter fluid on the ground, and you top it off with generally unhealthy forests that haven't had a good burn come in and clean them out for a while - it has all just added up.

Now the fires are no longer "clensing" - they're so hot they're closer to "sterilizing" - so what would normally be a "healthy" fire is now a killing fire.

Like I said - I'm glad I'm not a policy maker for land management right now.
_________________
"Only small minds want always to be right."
- Louis XIV

"...haven't you lived long enough to know that two men may honestly differ about a question and both be right?"
- Abraham Lincoln

Tom Treks · Gear Addict Joined: 12 Jan 2003 Posts: 3347

IGO · Joined: 08 Feb 2005 Posts: 4144 Location: Las Vegas

Can you imagine how reduced the Bark Beetle population is in a burned forest? Like 0.
_________________
"Surely all God's people, however serious or savage, great or small, like to play. Whales and elephants, dancing, humming gnats, and invisibly small mischievous microbes - all are warm with divine radium and must have lots of fun in them." John Muir

IGO · Joined: 08 Feb 2005 Posts: 4144 Location: Las Vegas

IGO · Joined: 08 Feb 2005 Posts: 4144 Location: Las Vegas

azbackpackr · Posted: 6/28/2006, 6:44 am Post subject:

There have been scattered thundershowers in the White Mtns. for the past several days. Hopefully that ol' monsoon machine is trying to get started!

Meanwhile, the closures in the A Bar S (Apache-Sitgreaves) are not extensive, but they do include Mt. Baldy. Shouldn't last long, hopefully will re-open middle of July.