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azhiker96
Joined: 05 Jan 2003
Posts: 1419
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 Posted: 6/15/2006, 9:17 am Post subject: It's just wrong. |
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I just saw this news report.
I don't care where someone stands on immigration, draining water supplies is wrong. I would have no problem with folks staking out the water drops and calling the border patrol when they see activity but letting people die of thirst is not right. Here's the text of the article.
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We try to save people from dying from dehydration," said Paula Mich, a volunteer with Humane Borders.
Mich, along with hundreds of other Humane Borders volunteers, travels into the wilderness each day to refill tanks with water meant for the lips of illegal immigrants crossing the border.
Marked with a blue flag, the jugs are placed deep in the desert just outside Tucson in areas where volunteers say the most illegal immigrants have died from dehydration.
"We save lives by doing this," said Humane Borders Volunteer Frank Saavedra. "I don't know how many, but if it's only one it's worth it."
Not everyone agrees with Humane Borders placing water tanks in areas heavily trafficked by illegal immigrants.
Mich says vandals have been coming out to the water stations, pulling the caps off the tanks and dumping the water out into the desert.
The volunteers also say vandals are destroying the blue flags that fly atop 30-foot poles in the middle of the desert -- flags the immigrants look for when seeking out a water station on their journeys.
"Flags have been destroyed, and not in this station but in others. They've put bullet holes [the water tanks]," Mich said.
Mich also says each week Humane Borders finds at least one or more of their 70 water tanks vandalized, an act these volunteers say can kill.
"If they're planning on getting their water at that location and they get there and there's no water, then the next time they could get water could be not before they die," Saavedra said.
Russ Dove, a local immigration activist, says he understands why people trash the tanks.
"The vandal issue is a sign that Americans have had enough," Dove said, "and from observation, I think it's only going to get worse."
Dove says Humane Borders is helping illegal immigrants, some he calls criminals, cross the border safely.
"These are robbers, rapists, murders. This is simply aiding and abetting criminal activity," Dove said.
The volunteers, however, say the border crossers are innocent, crossing in search of a better life.
"We're going to continue to do this regardless of how many empty tanks we find," Mich said. "We're going to continue to do this." |
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It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. -- Carl Sagan |
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Shawn
I'll sell you map to Lost Dutchman mine!
Joined: 03 Jan 2003
Posts: 2592
Location: Ahwatukee, AZ
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| Posted: 6/15/2006, 9:44 am Post subject: |
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That's my take on this also. Whatever the politics, people dying in the desert is wrong. We don' t have to think about it, debate it, fight over it--they are dying, we have water, we give them water, anything else is for another time. This is hate.
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The bear went over the mountain to see what he could see. |
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Andy
Joined: 25 Nov 2003
Posts: 338
Location: Apache Junction
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fairweather8588
Joined: 30 Dec 2003
Posts: 716
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| Posted: 6/15/2006, 11:39 am Post subject: |
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Hell let's make a sidewalk for them too. Those pesky cholla needles can be just as annoying as that little dehydration thing.
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But let the mind beware, that though the flesh be bugged, the circumstances of existence are pretty glorious
Kerouac |
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Andy
Joined: 25 Nov 2003
Posts: 338
Location: Apache Junction
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| Posted: 6/15/2006, 12:12 pm Post subject: |
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| fairweather8588 wrote: |
| Hell let's make a sidewalk for them too. Those pesky cholla needles can be just as annoying as that little dehydration thing. |
Cynicism from one so young! Congratulations! You have arrived! 
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fairweather8588
Joined: 30 Dec 2003
Posts: 716
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| Posted: 6/15/2006, 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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But let the mind beware, that though the flesh be bugged, the circumstances of existence are pretty glorious
Kerouac |
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CatValet
Got Gear?
Joined: 04 Jan 2003
Posts: 735
Location: Scottsdale
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| Posted: 6/15/2006, 12:49 pm Post subject: |
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It's not just cynicism. People are fed up. Demographics tells the story. Population projections show that we will have a Mexican-origin majority by 2030 or before. Non-hispanic reproduction rates are below the replacement level, further contributing to the rate of change. I'm afraid of their voting behavior as well and how it will impact my financial lifestyle and my family estate. Debates on whether to eliminate the estate tax or double it are the tip of the iceberg of this debate. (As an only child you don't have to guess my position-or my parents'-on this one)
Europe has a similar issue with Muslims, and their birth rates are below ours. Tony Blankley's book "The West's Last Chance" explains this quite well.
It even effects hiking. Bet the risk factor has gone up for those hiking the Chiricahuas and Huachucas-or at least for their vehicles left at trailheads. |
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cactuscat
Joined: 04 Jan 2003
Posts: 459
Location: Phoenix
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| Posted: 6/15/2006, 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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Gee, I only wish I had a "family estate" to worry about!  |
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Andy
Joined: 25 Nov 2003
Posts: 338
Location: Apache Junction
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Shawn
I'll sell you map to Lost Dutchman mine!
Joined: 03 Jan 2003
Posts: 2592
Location: Ahwatukee, AZ
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| Posted: 6/15/2006, 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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Being of sound mind and body, I spent it all.
But back on topic, all good points, but anyone dying in the desert of thirst is not the solution.
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The bear went over the mountain to see what he could see. |
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Andy
Joined: 25 Nov 2003
Posts: 338
Location: Apache Junction
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sidhayes
Joined: 04 Jan 2003
Posts: 116
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| Posted: 6/15/2006, 3:10 pm Post subject: |
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| If Humane Borders wants to aid and abet illegal activity, which is a crime, then individual cititizens and groups can certainly Legally "vandalize" water stations. In fact, it is something that should be done. The solution, as everyone knows, is simple- No illegal trespassing by crawing across our southern border=no deaths by dehydration. Apply for entry , wait your turn, if it ever comes. ( it is not some kind of right to enter our country), and then come in legally, as many proud latinos have done. |
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Andy
Joined: 25 Nov 2003
Posts: 338
Location: Apache Junction
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| Posted: 6/15/2006, 3:26 pm Post subject: |
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| sidhayes wrote: |
| If Humane Borders wants to aid and abet illegal activity, which is a crime, then individual cititizens and groups can certainly Legally "vandalize" water stations. In fact, it is something that should be done. The solution, as everyone knows, is simple- No illegal trespassing by crawing across our southern border=no deaths by dehydration. Apply for entry , wait your turn, if it ever comes. ( it is not some kind of right to enter our country), and then come in legally, as many proud latinos have done. |
I agree that these water stations should not exist. But I don't like the idea of people dying in the desert of thirst either! If Humane Borders wants to help they should be below the border educating the prospective border jumpers on the fact they need to be better supplied before they begin their trek! Maybe they could hand out Camelbacks or something! News of these water caches will only increase the flow!
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Hnak
Joined: 06 Jan 2003
Posts: 1766
Location: Prescott, AZ
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| Posted: 6/15/2006, 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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I wonder if the Native Americans / Indians felt this way a couple hundred years ago....
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The world is older and bigger than we are. This is a hard truth for some folks to swallow. —EDWARD ABBEY |
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Andy
Joined: 25 Nov 2003
Posts: 338
Location: Apache Junction
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| Posted: 6/15/2006, 3:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Hnak wrote: |
| I wonder if the Native Americans / Indians felt this way a couple hundred years ago.... |
Probably! Sadly, there just wasn't enough of them to do much about it!
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