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What are you packin?
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Dirt Dog





Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 171
Location: AJ

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 12:55 pm    Post subject: What are you packin? Reply to topic Reply with quote

I use an external frame and love it; does anyone else use an E-frame? I use to pack an internal frame pack but I just never felt comfortable with it, it felt like a monkey on my back. I was always sweaty where the pack was against my back and was limited as to what I could take, 4000cu. in. means 4000cu. in.! I solo hike so I don’t worry about being laughed at for using one, and I can dance in the desert with one on even when I’m off trail. My pack with 2 gal. of water is around 46lbs and not a problem. At 60lbs. I slow down but it’s manageable. Soooo… What is it that you like about your I-frame pack? Or your E-frame pack if there is anyone still using one. Smile
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Melissa





Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 10
Location: Mesa, AZ

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

How does the stability of an E-frame pack feel? I have just started doing the research necessary to buy a pack, since this is the year I begin my backpacking experience...day trips are great, but don't quench my thirst anymore. The REI guy told me that the external frames are more forgiving for the less-than-perfect packing ability, but that an internal frame is better for stability when hiking, scrambling, etc... what do you think?
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CatValet
Got Gear?




Joined: 04 Jan 2003
Posts: 735
Location: Scottsdale

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

Both.....Externals can be cooler as you noted. Some of the new internal frames have better breathability than the older models, however. I played mule once and carried 80 pounds to Havasupai (down, not up-it was mostly group food for people in our party that had overpacked for their mules) and my Dana K2 Loadmaster did a great job of balancing the load.

I have found few new externals that really have state of the art suspension; I guess they have stopped trying since it is a small market share. For reasonable weight loads I prefer internal frames. They balance much better and are far better for places where balance is critical. (For example, I would nt want to go down the Boucher or some of the other more exposed rustic trails in the Canyon, with a wide external that catches the wind) Internals are also better for scrambling through brushy or forested areas off trail, since they hang up less in the branches.

I have a couple Osprey packs and really love their suspension. Far and away most comfortable packs I've ever carried.

Get fitted carefully and with a weighted pack for the best results. -Randy
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Tom Treks
Gear Addict




Joined: 12 Jan 2003
Posts: 3347

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

CatValet wrote:
I have found few new externals that really have state of the art suspension; I guess they have stopped trying since it is a small market share.


Externals have definitely lost their appeal the past few years. Probably due to more and more trekkers taking the rough routes. They can be a bit cumbersome through heavy brush and tougher scrambles.

I didn't care for an external frame until I actually tried one. They really are the more comfortable pack on a normal trail. The Kelty 50th anniv pack I recently bought carries a heavy load very nicely. It's a pretty huge pack yet only weighs in at 5 lbs.

I also have other internal packs of lesser size that I use for lighter, more compact loads.

It really just comes down to preference. Go out and try a few of each, but make sure the packs are fitted and weighted properly for the test.

Melissa, if you find something that feels good, come on back here and ask around. I can guarantee someone has either owned one, or knows someone who has.
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Daddee
I once was a slug.




Joined: 04 Jan 2003
Posts: 2815
Location: Mesa, AZ

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

I'm a big fan of internal frames. I agree with everyone else, externals are easier to load, they can carry a heavier load more comfortably, etc., etc. I just personally don't like using them much.

I always feel a little out of balance when carying an external frame. Not by a lot, but enough to annoy me. Internal frames just feel like they're part of me and I can move much better. Another item for me was the room behind the head. My internal frame sits below the top of my head, so I can wear a wide brim hat without any trouble. With an external fram it rides higher and it always seemed to be bumping my head.

The noise is also annoying - all the clinking and creaking from all the pins and joints of an external frame is distracting. Internal frames aren't silent, but they do a better job of keeping the noise down.

So for me it's not really an issue of convenience or load or ease of packabiltiy or anything like that - it's a comfort issue. I just like the feel of an internal frame better.
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Dirt Dog





Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 171
Location: AJ

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

Melissa wrote:
How does the stability of an E-frame pack feel? I have just started doing the research necessary to buy a pack, since this is the year I begin my backpacking experience...day trips are great, but don't quench my thirst anymore. The REI guy told me that the external frames are more forgiving for the less-than-perfect packing ability, but that an internal frame is better for stability when hiking, scrambling, etc... what do you think?


Melissa,
For me an E-frame is stable, yet I have to admit that an I-frame by pure physics will be more stable. I would never try scrambling, that’s a quick way to the bottom. I enjoy being able to walk upright most of the time because of the higher center gravity, because of the lower center of gravity on an I-frame, I tend to lean farther forward which fatigues me quicker. I’ve used E-frames in mountains with no loss of stability as long as I don’t try blazing, the most loss of stability for me happens when I have no pack on at all. I never bull my way through brush or trees, I go around or take my pack off, attach a rope and pull it. I think you would be happier with an I-frame, E-frames are history.

CatValet wrote:
Both.....Externals can be cooler as you noted. Some of the new internal frames have better breathability than the older models, however. I played mule once and carried 80 pounds to Havasupai (down, not up-it was mostly group food for people in our party that had overpacked for their mules) and my Dana K2 Loadmaster did a great job of balancing the load.

I have found few new externals that really have state of the art suspension; I guess they have stopped trying since it is a small market share. For reasonable weight loads I prefer internal frames. They balance much better and are far better for places where balance is critical. (For example, I would nt want to go down the Boucher or some of the other more exposed rustic trails in the Canyon, with a wide external that catches the wind) Internals are also better for scrambling through brushy or forested areas off trail, since they hang up less in the branches.

I have a couple Osprey packs and really love their suspension. Far and away most comfortable packs I've ever carried.

Get fitted carefully and with a weighted pack for the best results. -Randy


Does the Osprey carry ~ 45lbs. comfortably? And if you would, explain the suspension a little.
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Arizonaheat
Got Supes Juice?




Joined: 04 Jan 2003
Posts: 1741
Location: Mesa, AZ

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

Quote:
Does the Osprey carry ~ 45lbs. comfortably? And if you would, explain the suspension a little


http://www.ospreypacks.com/
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Davis2001R6





Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Posts: 5591
Location: Italy

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

I've only used an internal frame, but I love my Gregory Reality pack. It's eighs 5lbs 2 oz and is 4650 ci. My last hike I had about 45 lbs in it and didn't have any problems. I do need the larger waistbelt for it so that should help even more.
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Dirt Dog





Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 171
Location: AJ

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

Thanks Arizonaheat for the link, but alas no Info just marketing talk-"The award-winning Aether 60 has a unique suspension that balances flexibility and load support beautifully." Confused
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Davis2001R6





Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Posts: 5591
Location: Italy

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

Check out these reviews:
http://www.backpackgeartest.org/reviews/Packs/Internal%20and%20External%20Framed%20Backpacks/Osprey%20Aether%2060/
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Dirt Dog





Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 171
Location: AJ

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

Thanks Davis2001R6, that has what I was wondering about, it will handle 50lbs. no prob. Very Happy
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JW
I'll make rain with my spaceman powers!




Joined: 20 Sep 2003
Posts: 1296

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

We just got back from an Easter backpack down/up Tanner in the canyon. Going down and negotiating the packed ice, in snow and hail, I think all of us appreciated the lower center-of-gravity of our IFs. Mine was about 50lbs.

On Saturday afternoon, I soloed an ancient route up to a summit ruin site. Packing only a bunch of water and misc stuff, the lower center of gravity made it feel like an over-sized day-pack, while climbing a ridge contour that was more vertical than horizontal (maybe 2-3,000 vertical gain).

I've used my IF backpack in all seasons now, and while the only time the lack of back ventilation is an irritant, is mid-summer in the Supes. But not many of us get out there in the Summer.
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DesertRoux





Joined: 10 Jul 2004
Posts: 397
Location: Scottsdale

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

Most of my hikes are weekenders. (1-2 nights) I now carry a GoLite "Infinity". I hardly even know its there. It can carry loads at 30 pounds with full support and comfort. Plus the crazy"EX" padding breaths great. Im hardly ever wet.

For longer outings Im still using my old Kelty "Pikes Peak". Its an internal frame and can carry anything I want. It'll be heavy but the pack won't break.

If I'm walking a nice level terrain, I'd love to carry an External frame. But more times than not, the trail isnt level, there are rocks and obstacles. I like the balance and mobility an internal frame offers.
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Arizonaheat
Got Supes Juice?




Joined: 04 Jan 2003
Posts: 1741
Location: Mesa, AZ

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

Dirt Dog open the link I gave you then click on the Product icon select mens or womens, then click on each individual pack, it will open an interactive guide. The specification button will list size, weight capacity and all other pertinent info.
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Dirt Dog





Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 171
Location: AJ

PostPosted: 3/30/2005, 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply to topic Reply with quote

Thanks for trying, but this is all I get Arizonaheat "The page cannot be found". Any ways
Davis2001R6 link answered my question, the suspension is made of composites and can carry 40-60lbs. Thanks Smile
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