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DesertRoux
Joined: 10 Jul 2004 Posts: 397 Location: Scottsdale
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Posted: 5/10/2007, 5:06 pm Post subject: Havasu Canyon Article in Backpacker |
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This month's BACKPACKER MAGAZINE has an article about the vanishing of a 34 year old japanese backpacker by Havasu Falls. I know a lot of us here have a subscription, but for those who don't it looks like an interesting read to say the least. I just snagged it out of my mailbox but have a few more errands to run. I'll have to read it later. Just wanted to give everyone a heads up if they were interested. _________________ Good people... drink good beer.
-Hunter S. Thompson |
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Suz
Joined: 27 Nov 2005 Posts: 3186
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Posted: 5/10/2007, 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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Didn't it turn out that she was murdered by a local? |
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Davis2001R6
Joined: 12 Dec 2003 Posts: 5591 Location: Italy
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Posted: 5/10/2007, 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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Yes it was a local, it was posted on here some time ago, just don't have time to search for it right now. They guy was already under investigation for a previous crime as well. |
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DesertRoux
Joined: 10 Jul 2004 Posts: 397 Location: Scottsdale
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Posted: 5/10/2007, 6:23 pm Post subject: |
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The article is about all the politics revolving around the tribe and is just a closer glimpse of the rundown. Here is a quote form BACKPACKER's editor.
"The incident that precipitated this story isn't in dispute: Last May, a solo japanese hiker vanished near Havasu Falls on her 34th birthday. But nothing else has been so straightforward-not the police investigation, the odd response from tribal elders, nor the tangled motives of certain key characters. Only after 5 months of dogged reporting and four risky trips into the canyon did Annette pierce the wall of silence that slammed down in the days after the hiker's disappearance."
I still haven't had the chance to read the article but I'm intrigued. My kids are being too crazy right now, maybe I'll get a chance after dinner. _________________ Good people... drink good beer.
-Hunter S. Thompson |
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mthorne
Joined: 14 Feb 2006 Posts: 21 Location: Salt Lake City, UT
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Posted: 5/22/2007, 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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I read the article yesterday - but I haven't ever been down there. Would be interested to hear what anyone who's been there recently thinks about the article. At least from reading the article - it sounds like it's not really a pleasant place to visit now - is it really that bad? I'm also curious because a friend of mine is supposed to lead a church group down there in July. _________________ I never saw an ugly thing in my life: for let the form of an object be what it may - light, shade, and perspective will always make it beautiful.
-John Constable (1776 - 1837) |
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sacred_datura
Joined: 18 Apr 2007 Posts: 138 Location: Scottsdale, Arizona
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Posted: 5/23/2007, 12:15 am Post subject: |
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I have yet to read the article but I talked with one of the tribe council woman about the incident shortly after the incident occured. I think the tribe is being unfairly judged in a negative light based on one fool's actions. My husband and I were married at Navajo Falls, and visited last August for our anniversary. Everything seemed relatively normal to me. |
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Hikngrl Canyoneering is my 'Happy Place'
Joined: 27 May 2003 Posts: 5578 Location: Peoria, AZ
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Posted: 5/23/2007, 5:56 am Post subject: |
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I read the article and it left me feeling similar to the way I have always felt about the plight of the American Indian. Ambiguous. It seems that long ago the American government did them terribly wrong (if you read the article you will be surprised as some of the things you learn) then to try and make up for it set them up into a system that by their (the American Indian) actions and the governments, cripples them into a horrible life style. They perpetuate the things that are making life so bad for them when they could choose to rise above these things. However when I use the word "they" it is like saying all white people have done the American Indian wrong...We all know that not every American Indian is into drugs and alcohol and crime any more than all white people are or all black people are.
I was down there last year with several people from here and thought the place was beautiful. It was not terribly dirty except the porta potty situation, which if the department of health had anything to say about it (which they don't) the place would probably be closed down for that reason alone. It seems there is a lot of behind the scenes crime going on that had I known about I would not have been so comfortable down there at night when I went to go to the bathroom by myself in the dark. Like any other "bad neighborhood" be it populated by whites, Hispanics, blacks or Indians take caution and don't go places on your own and take care of your belongings.
To "fix" Havasupai it will most likely take the same thing it will take to achieve world peace......each individual's desire and cooperation working in earnest toward the same goal. That is a difficult thing to get I am afraid.
The proceeding is my point of view and may not be P.C. _________________ ~~~Diane~~~
I want to shine! |
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Davis2001R6
Joined: 12 Dec 2003 Posts: 5591 Location: Italy
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Posted: 5/23/2007, 8:31 am Post subject: |
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Diane, you almost got talking politics there
I for one don't feel so "sorry" for the Indians and feel they have ample opportunity in todays world to move ahead and change their lifestyle.
As for heading back thier, like Diane said I don't think it would be any different now as opposed to before the murder. The town a Sh**hole, trash everywhere, horrible sanitary conditions. But the falls are beautiful. |
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Hikngrl Canyoneering is my 'Happy Place'
Joined: 27 May 2003 Posts: 5578 Location: Peoria, AZ
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Posted: 5/23/2007, 9:50 am Post subject: |
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Davis2001R6 wrote: |
Diane, you almost got talking politics there
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Yeah, I was teatering right on the edge wasn't I!? However I did include the disclaimer.... _________________ ~~~Diane~~~
I want to shine! |
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desertgirl
Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 3350 Location: Chandler, AZ
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Posted: 5/23/2007, 11:36 am Post subject: |
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Wonder what the general response will be if they choose to "commercialize" their incredible natural assets akin to S.Rim ? Safe - clean place, good food options, a road to the Falls with informative plates ?
Any why is the general response "quaint and authentic" when its the same squalid mess in Mexico, Far-East or Africa ? Nepal/Africa is the same porta potty mess Do you think we should pack out our waste - we do that at other places - Paria, Colorado river trips ...Why not here ?
Having said this -- I do think the place has headed downhill in the past 10 years ... Environmental pressures of being "discovered" along with all the other issues that plague Supai. _________________ Photos: http://www.pbase.com/desertgirl/galleries
Life is but a dream ...there is no end to what you can dream! |
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BoyNhisDog The dangerous place where the winds meet
Joined: 05 Jan 2003 Posts: 1375 Location: Tucson
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Posted: 5/23/2007, 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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I read the article and it really sounds like every Rez I have ever lived on. They are third-world countries. Alcoholism was running near 80% back then and I doubt that anything has changed except for the added drugs. As a group, they just can’t seem to rise above. As individuals, some do. My first girlfriend was Chippewa/French up on a cold remote Rez and she was pretty, animated and engaging. Life is a different thing to them than it is to most of us. They are different in their mannerisms and thinking. I saw some stunningly awesome and odd things in my time with them. They can be the same at times as well, just people.
The only monetary charity we do is buy a woodstove and have it installed once a year for the Navajos near Gallup. We give a lot of food gifts too. There are a lot of older folks who live very remote who don’t have a decent stove to make a cup of soup or tea.
But what happened 100 years ago does not matter anymore and they will either rise above or be eaten up. That is the way. All of us have ancestors some where back in the line if you go back far enough who lived a stone age life. That is not possible anymore no matter how you look at it. Even the Paleo Indians who crossed the land bridge 25,000 years ago had to finally turn to agriculture after some time to survive. There simply was not enough territory to support them all. One hunter/gatherer per square mile is the maximum density and they had reached that by 10,500 years ago. Times change. The way is to shrug it off and move on but some tend to hold on too long for whatever reason. Every Rez has its bootleggers as in the article on the Supai and that just saps them. It is cheap entertainment and is learned at a very early age. That is where I grew up. _________________ Seize from every moment its unique novelty and do not prepare your joys
- Andre Gide |
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JW I'll make rain with my spaceman powers!
Joined: 20 Sep 2003 Posts: 1296
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Posted: 5/23/2007, 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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BoyNhisDog wrote: |
I read the article and it really sounds like every Rez I have ever lived on. They are third-world countries...I saw some stunningly awesome and odd things in my time with them. They can be the same at times as well, just people...We give a lot of food gifts too. There are a lot of older folks who live very remote who don’t have a decent stove to make a cup of soup or tea...Even the Paleo Indians who crossed the land bridge 25,000 years ago had to finally turn to agriculture after some time to survive. There simply was not enough territory to support them all. One hunter/gatherer per square mile is the maximum density and they had reached that by 10,500 years ago. Times change... That is where I grew up. |
Hey Mr. G., I have to go get to the article, but I know of it and a lot of the references. Ah yes, you've read Marg. Mead, and know your references, and you do know the people. I've met several kind and decent individuals (and one of the elders) in the village, and in certain ways they are hamstrung in addressing issues. Ironically, the youngest children are sweet, open, into learning and ready for the 21st century global village, and so are many a generation and one-half their elders. But there is an intermediate age range that is realatively mobile, and (is it hormones?) seems to be involved in "stuff".
One of the nicest people I've had the pleasure to hike with was a ranger at Keet Seel (I was also a .Gov employee at that time), and he was into independent study, loved his job, and took us (in his off-duty time) into the side canyons to view the rock art (actually from several cultures). People like him will make it no matter what; I sincerely believe in the overwhelming "goodness" of the people, my friend! _________________ What a magnificent time to LIVE! - Everett Ruess.
Since my house burned down, I now own a better view of the rising moon. - Masahide. |
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